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Transcript
- 02:26 Dr. Terry Wahls’ Story
- 04:39 What is an autoimmune disease?
- 07:33 The Wahls Protocol
- 10:01 Vegetarian Diet and MS
- 12:35 The Wahls Protocol and Paleo
- 14:33 Fats and Ketosis
- 16:18 Nightshades and Autoimmunity
- 19:22 Supplementation
- 22:07 TMG for Detoxing
- 22:28 Detoxing Heavy Metals
- 24:59 Infrared Saunas for Detox
- 26:21 Clinical Trials
- 29:10 Can the Wahls Protocol heal other diseases?
- 30:32 Contact Dr. Terry Wahls
Wendy Myers: Welcome to the Live to 110 Podcast. I’m your host, Wendy Myers. Today, we are interviewing Dr. Terry Wahls. I’m really excited about this interview.
Dr. Terry Wahls has healed herself of multiple sclerosis. She was once a marathon runner and a mountain climber. She was diagnosed with MS and was soon confined to a wheelchair. Dr. Wahls had already relied on drugs and surgery to treat her patients, but found that as a patient herself, conventional medicine was failing her. So determined to find a cure, Dr. Wahls switched from a vegetarian to a Paleo diet and began various therapies to reverse her symptoms to the point where she was able to walk without a cane and even bike 18 miles in one day. Her new book, The Wahls Protocol: How I Beat Progressive MS Using Paleo Principles and Functional Medicine details her extraordinary findings and her recovery and provides a step-by-step guide to regain control of your health while living with autoimmune disease.
Please keep in mind that this program is not intended to diagnose or heal any disease or health condition. This podcast is solely informational in nature. Please consult your healthcare practitioner before engaging in any diet or regime that we mention on the show today.
Dr. Wahls is a physician and a clinical professor of medicine at the University of Iowa Carver College of Medicine in Iowa City. She is the only doctor who is testing the Paleo diet in a clinical setting to heal disease namely autoimmune and MS.
Dr. Wahls’ book, The Wahls Procotol details about how to address the underlying cause of disease by employing a nutrient-dense Paleo diet, a supplement plan to feed the mitochondria and increase the body’s energy. She is also using exercise, detox and other therapies to heal the body of disease.
What I love most about this book is how it puts the care in the hands of the patient and disease firmly under their control and empowers them to get their life back.
So, Dr. Wahls, thank you so much for coming on the show.
Dr. Terry Wahls: Oh, thank you. I’m thrilled to be here.
Wendy Myers: So why don’t you tell the listeners your story. You have a very compelling story.
Dr. Terry Wahls: Sure. So I’m a clinical professor of medicine. I think alternative medicine is a bunch of hooey. I’m very into drugs, the latest findings that are within general medicine.
In 2000, I’m diagnosed with MS. I decided to treat my disease aggressively, so I go to the best MS center I could find, the Cleveland Clinic. Within three years, my disease has progressed to secondary progressive MS. In that phase, there was no more remissions or improvement. It was a steady decline. They tell me, “Functions once lost, gone forever.”
Wendy Myers: Yeah.
Dr. Terry Wahls: I get the wheelchair that was recommended. I took Mitoxantrone, a form of chemotherapy. I took Tysabri, a very potent immune-suppressing drug about $42,000 a year and continued to decline. That’s when I started reading the science and I began my self-experimentation. It was clear I was headed toward a bed-ridden, demented life.
The Wahls Protocol details that journey, how I discovered Paleo medicine, how I discovered in functional medicine, how I had the insight to combine them, so that I have this long list of nutrients not from synthetic sources, but I redesigned my diet using Paleo principles to get them through food.
I added/resumed my meditation, did exercise, electrical stimulation by muscles – so a big lifestyle change. Within three months, I can walk with a cane. Within six months, I’m walking throughout the hospital, no cane. And within nine months, I’m able to do an 18-mile bike tour with my family.
Wendy Myers: Wow.
Dr. Terry Wahls: My family and I were crying because I had come to terms with I was going to be disabled forever. I really had to do that 18-mile bike ride before I understood I was breaking all the rule. Who knew what was going to happen?
It obviously changed how I viewed disease, how I viewed health. It changed my clinical practice and it changed the focus of my clinical research.
Wendy Myers: So your book focuses on healing autoimmune diseases like MS.
Dr. Terry Wahls: Yes.
Wendy Myers: And today, it’s estimated that 75 million people either have a diagnosis or they have the antibodies for autoimmune just at a subclinical level. But what exactly is an autoimmune disease and why is the prevalence of these diseases increasing?
Dr. Terry Wahls: Oh, yeah. So our immune cells have the ability to, when they’re going around inspecting all of our one trillion cells that we have, they could decide, “Okay, that belongs to me. It doesn’t belong to me. I need to attack it.”
What has happened is that for reasons that people don’t quite know, some prior infection altered our structures in some way that the immune cells, when they approach it now see it as an infecting organism and begin attacking you. So with MS, they’re attacking my brain and spinal cord; with rheumatoid arthritis, they’re attacking joints; with lupus, they’re attacking the cells themselves.
Why? Are we having more? I think we have several clues. One is the dramatic intake of sugar. In 1700, we had 10 lbs. a year; in 2000, we had 100 lbs. a year. That’s really increased the leaky gut where the gut lets incompletely digested food into the blood stream triggering an immune response. Dr. Fasano wrote a great paper outlining that the leaky gut is the first step in developing autoimmunity.
Another thing that really revs up the autoimmune problem are lead, mercury, arsenic, plastics, heavy metals. And of course, we’re at an increasingly toxic environment. The diet quality has declined, so people’s ability to process a lot of those toxins have also declined further increasing autoimmunity.
For MS, I believe the incident rates is up 40% in 15 years. We now have children as young as six with MS. And this was a disease that was not described before 1836 I believe.
Wendy Myers: Yeah, I’ve read that it’s one of the fastest growing subsets of diseases in the world.
Dr. Terry Wahls: Yes, and it’s diet and lifestyle related. We have thousands of papers that show us the genes account for 85%. If you happen to have two parents with MS, it may get up to 30%. Always, it’s the diet and lifestyle that accounts for 72.97% of your risk for MS.
Wendy Myers: Yeah. And doctors are telling their patients, they’re just telling them, “Oh, there’s nothing you can do. Just take drugs. You just have to live with it.”
Dr. Terry Wahls: Yes. And to me, our docs don’t realize that epigenetics are the big driver that projects our diet and lifestyle.
Wendy Myers: So how did you come up with your protocol and how quickly did you use the various therapy in your protocol? How quickly did you recover?
Dr. Terry Wahls: Here’s the sequence. I was diagnosed in 2002. My Cleveland Clinic neurology doctor told me about Loren Cordain. I got the book. I gave up being a vegetarian, began Paleo, still declined.
2003, hit the wheelchair. 2004, I start reading the mouse and rat studies and started adding vitamins and supplements. I slowed down the steepness of my decline. It’s a little flatter – I’m very, very grateful – but still declining.
2007, I discovered electrical stimulation by muscles. I convinced my physical therapist to do that when I exercise, so I get more oomph from the exercise. And then at the same time that I’m discovering e-stim, I discovered the Institute for Functional Medicine.
I take their course, a functional medicine approach for common and uncommon neurologic syndrome. It deepened my understanding. I have a longer list now of about 20 vitamins and supplements that I’m taking. I add those. And with the e-stim, what I see is maybe just a little hint of improvement.
And then I had this brilliant awareness like, “I should get these, all this stuff in the food that I’m eating.” So, I go talk to my registered dietitian friends. They’re like, “We don’t know where it is.” I go to the Health Science Library, they can’t find the text, but the University of Google can.
So more research. It takes me a month. I had a new food plan stressing these nutrients. And so a month, just a month – so I do this in December, by the end of January, my mind is so much more clearer, my energy has improved. I had to stop my Provigil because I can’t sleep at night because I’m no longer fatigue.
Then the next month in February, I start walking with a cane. People are like, “Dr. Wahls! Oh, my God! You’re walking.” Then in six months, I’m walking without a cane. At nine months, I’m on the bike.
This whole thing went from 2002 to 2007, but I’ve continued to learn. We’ve modified the protocol. I discussed that in my book, how I’ve changed things from what I did back in 2007, 2008.
Wendy Myers: Do you feel like your vegetarian diet contributed to MS?
Dr. Terry Wahls: I’m tender-hearted. As a kid, I named all of my animals (even the ones we’re going to eat). So I was very happy in high school to be a rebellious teen on the farm and say, “No meat.” I had no idea that B12 was going to be a problem.
Even though I went through medical school, somehow I was a vegetarian then. I don’t know how I missed being told that you need to pay more attention to B12, be more careful about the protein consumption. I probably had too many carbs.
I had a lot of antibiotics as a kid. I’m sure I had a yeast overgrowth. All those carbs were a problem. Lack of B12, a problem. Probably not enough protein, a problem. And also, I wasn’t tuned into the Omega 3, Omega 6 fats. So that was a problem.
So while it may be possible to do a vegetarian diet more safely – and I give people guides on how to do that – I clearly have not. And so for me, the way I chose to do my vegetarian diet was another part of why I became ill.
Wendy Myers: How long were you a vegetarian?
Dr. Terry Wahls: Oh, from high school to the end of about 2002. So for 20 years, I was a vegetarian. I ate some fish now and then during that time period. I wouldn’t go back to my vegetarian ways.
Wendy Myers: Yeah, I had to say, many of my clients, the sickest ones are the ones that were long-term vegans or vegetarians. It’s tough to do it correctly. You have to really know what you’re doing.
Dr. Terry Wahls: It’s very hard to do correctly. I know too many people who quit eating meat (like I did) failed at understanding the intricacies of how to create a safe diets. I see vegetarians eat a lot of white flour, sugar, no protein, no vegetables. They’re clearly going to be in trouble.
I do see vegetarians and vegans who get the vegetable part right, do that really well, detox, feeling great for two years. And then when they run out of their B12 and their minerals, then they start to deteriorate and I can’t figure out way.
Wendy Myers: Because you run out of B12 in three to five years, correct? You can get permanent neurological damage.
Dr. Terry Wahls: Yeah, lots of bad things happening to your brain. There’s a lot of neurobehavioral problems. And people, because they felt so good initially with their vegetarian diet, vegan diet, they have a really very hard time grasping that their diet may be contributing to their problem now.
Wendy Myers: Yeah, yeah. So can you briefly explain the Wahls diet that uses Paleo principles.
Dr. Terry Wahls: So what I’ve done is use the Paleo principles so there’s no gluten-containing grain. If you have gluten-free grains, it’s only once during a day. No dairy. I also take out eggs because the high risk for food sensitivity is there.
Then we structure to have nine cups of vegetables. This is for a man or a tall woman. I’m 6 ft. tall. Short women, petite people will need proportionately less. So it’s three cups of green leaves (cooked to raw), three cups of softer rich family vegetables (that’s cabbage family, onion family, mushroom family). We use those because of the impact they have on enthusing enzymes in the brain, in the liver and kidneys. And then three cups of deeply colored pigmented stuff (i.e. beats carrots, berries).
Protein to appetite. We’re looking for about 6 ounces to 12 ounces according to size and gender. I’d like to have some Omega 3 fats in there as well, either two tablespoons, vegetarian sources or fish oil depending on what the person is doing.
And then as you advance along, I move people to – so at the entry-level diet, I’d speak to the vegetarians and say, “You can do as a vegetarian or vegan. These are the principles and the concepts to improve your nutrient-density, reduce your food sensitivity issues, reduce [inaudible 00:14:06].” So I give them some directions for them. And then the next level is the Wahl’s Paleo. We talk ant organic meats, we talk about seaweed, we talk about spreading nuts and seeds.
And then the next level, we further reduce the carbohydrate intake. Now we’re going to add more fat, particularly medium chain triglycerides and I’m putting people in the ketosis.
Wendy Myers: Yes.
Wendy Myers: And how is that important for people with neurological issues?
Dr. Terry Wahls: So for millennia, humans were in ketosis every winter, every war, every famine. It turns out our brains once were just fine on ketones – and so do our muscles. So we can be very adaptive to being a fat-running machine.
We’ve known since the early 1900s that putting people in ketosis reduce the seizures and improves brain performance.
Now we have a bunch of studies going on looking at a variety of psychiatric and neurologic diseases using ketosis to reduce inflammation and improve healing. In here at University of Iowa, we have a bunch of studies using ketosis to treat cancer.
What I do that’s unique in my ketogenic diet is we put people in ketosis, then we also measured to be sure that we’re still having enough of the carbohydrates to get the 31 nutrients that science says are really important for the brain. Many of the ketogenic diets, short-term, get people to ketosis, do a great a job, but they’ll be like the vegans and vegetarians. If you aren’t truly nutrient replete, at three to five years, you can be running out of stuff. Then your health will decline. You’ll be going back, “Well, I felt great while I was in ketosis. I’m sure it’s not my diet” without realizing –
Again, ketogenic diets like the vegetarian and vegan diet, it’s really hard to do correctly. You have to really pay attention to make sure you’re getting all your vitamins, minerals and essential fats. The medium chain triglycerides help. In the structure we provide, we help people do that much more safely.
Wendy Myers: Okay. I had one question about the diets because many, many other people are talking about how you should avoiding night shades if you have autoimmune. So why is it exactly that you recommend that people can eat tomatoes and red bell peppers?
Dr. Terry Wahls: Great question. Thank you so much for asking. The first I did was focused on nutrient-density to get those 31 nutrients in. Then I took the top three for fruit sensitivities – gluten, dairy and eggs. I have people do that at level one.
Then in the book, we talked about, “Okay, if you’re not doing well, you can move on to the Paleo Plus or the Paleo and Paleo Plus diets,” but then I also list, “Here are the other food sensitivity problems… tomatoes, peppers, egg plants, potatoes, soy” and then acknowledge that for many, we need food sensitivity testing such as an LCAT or a Mediator Release Test or the Anabolic Test to personalize this. Night shades might be a problem, broccoli or shrimp or strawberries might be a problem. So I think personalization is really the best.
When I wrote the book and in our study, we worked with registered dietitians. It’s really important to be as least restrictive as possible and then have a plan to step-wise add more restrictions to your diet or more study to understand what restrictions are necessary.
I take issue with those who interpret the Paleo message to have a long list of things you can’t eat. That leaves people at risk for micronutrient deficiencies. I think you’d be much better served by having a food sensitivity assessment either with the elimination diet that’s done formally, food allergy testing through blood work, stool work or the LCAT, The Mediator Release Test, so it could be very specifically personalized.
Wendy Myers: Yeah, I agree. There’s no reason to exclude foods if you don’t have any issue with them. So you don’t feel that these night shades, the tomatoes and peppers can contribute to autoimmune?
Dr. Terry Wahls: Well, they may.
Wendy Myers: They may?
Dr. Terry Wahls: So may broccoli, so may shrimp. Any of the food that we could, I prefer a step-wise introduction, maximize nutrient-density, take out the worst offenders, heal the leaky gut and see how far you go.
Wendy Myers: Okay, yeah.
Dr. Terry Wahls: Then you may need to think about taking out night shades. What I’m impressed with in my clinical practice, twice, people have told me they do better without nightshades. Otherwise, I’m seeing superb results with healing the leaky gut just doing the gluten, dairy and eggs. But it had to be individualized.
Wendy Myers: Yeah, absolutely, absolutely.
Wendy Myers: So clearly, you encourage getting the majority of your vitamins and minerals and other nutrients from food. So why is it necessary to supplement today and what supplements do you recommend on your protocol?
Dr. Terry Wahls: So if we look at the mineral content of the soil, apparently, we’ve had about an 85% decline over the last hundred years according to USDA reports probably because of lack of crop rotation and the use of chelated fertilizers and herbicides like RoundUp.
If you measure the viable mineral content of an apple, chicken and beef, again, from 1919 to 1992, a 20%-100% decline in either the vitamin or mineral content.
So the nutrient density of our food even for eating all those vegetables is less than what our parents, our grandparents and our great grandparents had.
Now the foods that haven’t been as deluded are things that aren’t sweet. So your greens are still nutrient-dense. Your spices are still nutrient-dense. Your sulfur-containing vegetables are still nutrient-dense. Your colors will be a little less nutrient-dense than they use to be. So that’s part of why when we’ve designed our diet and done the analysis, we still have incredible nutrient-density in our food. Having said that, certainly, we can identify people with autoimmune diseases, mental health problems, heart diseases are more likely to have enzymes that are less efficient at metabolizing B Vitamins, less sufficient in how we handle sulfur.
So for that reason, a B complex – and I suggest this in my practice. If you’ve got a family history of bad heart, bad brain, a B vitamin is probably your friend.
You’ll likely have problems removing toxins. Therefore, [inaudible 00:21:28] would be your friend and maybe some sulfur amino acids to give a little bit more support as well.
Then we’ll talk about vitamin D. It’s very, very important to know what your level is and get it. My perfect level is between 80 and 100, but you can live with between 50 and 100. To get there, you really need to follow blood levels to know that you’re getting there.
And then, I’d like to have a sense of the essential fatty acid ratios in terms of Omega 3, Omega 6. You could get that through a cell membrane analysis and then really know. I talk about some other primary cure ways of assessing that.
Wendy Myers: Do you think about TMG or trimethylglycine to add some metal groups to help people to detox.
Dr. Terry Wahls: I’ve not used that, so I can’t comment from any personal experience. I think it would be vitamins, methyl B12 and for folate, very, very important. For some, that may be really helpful.
Wendy Myers: Just like you, I’m a huge proponent of detoxing heavy metals. I see them as a major underlying cause of disease today. I personally hair mineral analysis to test for metals, but of course, people have to do a detox program long-term to see how the metals are coming out. It doesn’t show on the first test.
So how do you test for heavy metals and detox yourself and your patients?
Dr. Terry Wahls: It’s sort of interesting. I’m two years into my recovery and then I’m thinking, “I know I must’ve toxin. I do a 24-hour heavy metal and it comes back diffusely positive. I’m like radioactive. I’ve got Berylium, Thalium, Uranium. I think there were just four metals that were not in the toxic range.
So this is two years into my recovery. I’m walking around, biking, feeling immensely better. I make a few adjustments on my protocol (upped the seaweed and algae, by the way). And so two more years later (so now we’re at four years) and you’re recovered. I repeat and everything’s out.
So that’s my personal healing story. In our clinical trial, we’re doing 24 heavy metals in the beginning and again at 12 months, what I saw – I expected people to decline and what we’re seeing is they’re actually increasing. The reason I think that happens is when you’re heavy metal poisoned, you can’t get the metals very effectively.
And so you have to resuscitate the person before the waters will begin to spill. We’ve resuscitated them, got the enzymes working better, fed them appropriately. And now at 12 months, they have diffusely in the urine. And then we do a very careful history. What are your exposures? Could we have gotten some more into lately? And then, most importantly, how you feel – how’s the energy, quality of life. Our conclusion is the change is probably a reflection of the resuscitation of the enzymes, not an introduction of more toxin into them.
Wendy Myers: Yeah, yeah. I find that with my clients as well. Once we get on the right diet, tons of vegetables, good supplements and minerals, then the body releases them out for three or six months or so. It doesn’t start releasing that before that typically. You’ve got to resuscitate them. I know that word.
Dr. Terry Wahls: No, [inaudible 00:24:55] enzyme so they’ll work. Yeah, absolutely.
Wendy Myers: So do you infrared saunas to help detox your patients?
Dr. Terry Wahls: MS folks, he really makes the MS symptoms that much worse. In my clinical trial, no. In my personal practice, it’s interesting, nine months into a recovery, I could tolerate the heal and get a sauna. I want to start adding regular saunas to my regime. In my clinical practice – oh, we do talked about Sauna and sweating as an adjunct to detox. I talk about clay and zeolite as well.
Wendy Myers: So do you find that even if the MS patients are sensitive to that and that it increases their symptoms, do you find that might be a necessary healing reaction so to speak to get them detoxed so that they can recover quicker or do you prefer to wait until they can handle it better.
Dr. Terry Wahls: I don’t put them in heat until they feel like they’ve recovered. And then I have them do a test session just to see how well they will tolerate. Some people haven’t, like me, recovered their heat tolerance. I’ve added saunas and are doing extremely well. Those who are not, then I’d stay with the clay zeolite and gentler forms of detox.
Wendy Myers: I want to talk a little bit about your clinical trials. Can you tell the listeners a little bit about some of the research that you’re currently conducting and what prompted you to do that?
Dr. Terry Wahls: One case recover, people say like, “So what?” I’d seen clinically, people were doing extraordinarily well. My dean of the medical school helped me assemble a team to design a clinical trial. To everyone’s surprise (including mine), I was quite successful at getting funding from a private foundation in Canada, so we’re answering the question, “Could people do it, this complicated regimen? Was it safe for them? And if they did, what happened?”
This is such a radical way of treating MS. Our institution review board that does the oversight said, “You know what? Do ten. Give us a safety report, then we’ll decide if we can let you do the rest of your study.” So we did that. And of course, our safety report was very good. We got to enroll the rest of the folks. We’ve now published the first ten and we showed that, “Yup, people can do this.” The biggest problem is that if you’re overweight, you’ll lose weight without being hungry. That’s the biggest side effect.
And fatigue, fatigue is extraordinarily difficult to treat for MS. It’s the number one reason why people become disabled. The fatigues are of various scale. It goes from seven (total fatigue) to one (no fatigue). The FDA has approved the drug, Provigil on a basis of 0.5 improvement, which clinically is not much (I took Provigil for many years), it doesn’t do much, but you’re so grateful to have even that tiny amount, so people are happy to take it. Yeah, our trial, people started at 5.7 – so really quite fatigued. It came down to 3.9%. There is no other paper that has reported that level of improvement.
We definitely observed this. People, if they stopped the protocol, the fatigue shot back up just as high as it was before. So we’re making it very clear now (and that’s second proof that’s coming through) that from our perspective, this is a new way of living. This is not a diet. It’s not a lifestyle. This is a new way of living if you want yourselves to be healthy, vibrant and be getting your life back.
Wendy Myers: Yeah, your protocol sounds very similar to the principles that I’ve studied for years to figure out what works, what doesn’t, what should I adopt. It’s definitely something I think that anyone can adapt to heal their body of any imaginable symptom. They need the right diet right supplements, detox, et cetera.
Wendy Myers: So your book is very focused on autoimmune, but can this heal other diseases and symptoms as well.
Dr. Terry Wahls: That’s a great question. I have thousands of followers. Hundreds of people reached out and said, “I’m using the Wahls protocol and it’s helped this” – so Parkinson’s, early cognitive decline; fibromyalgia, depression – you know, a variety of psychiatric problems. And of course, the obvious, obesity, diabetes, other autoimmune conditions, bowel disease, lupus, everyone’s read the arthritis, asthma, psoriasis, eczema and then a whole bunch of autoimmune diseases that I’ve never heard of before, I might add. [Inaudible 00:29:51], “Okay, I guess this is autoimmune now, alright.”
Wendy Myers: There’s a lot of them. There’s a lot of them.
Dr. Terry Wahls: And every year, we’re adding tens and tens. I expect that ultimately, we’ll realize that all over, chronic disease is at least in some capacities are autoimmune. For example, heart disease is now being studied as an autoimmune condition.
Wendy Myers: Yeah, they do say that. I think the atherosclerosis is autoimmune.
Dr. Terry Wahls: It’s autoimmune. High blood pressure is really an autoimmune condition; so is schizosphrenia. I think in another 20 years, we’ll realize that all of our chronic lifestyle diseases have an autoimmune component.
Wendy Myers: Yes, yes.
Wendy Myers: So can you tell the listeners a little bit more about yourself and where they can find you?
Dr. Terry Wahls: Sure. So please go to my website, terrywahls.com. We have a lot of materials that you can download that were mentioned in the book. If you have MS and you have fatigue and you want to hear more about our clinical trials (because we are still recruiting), call my secretary at 319-356-4421, Arlene. So it’s 319-356-4421.
Wendy Myers: So what if someone wants to see you privately, do you have a private practice where clients can see you.
Dr. Terry Wahls: Sadly, no. All of my clinical time is at the Veterans’ Hospital. That’s where I see traumatic brain injury and a therapeutic lifestyle crawling with very complex chronic medical issues, many autoimmune problems. I do not have a private practice, unfortunately.
Wendy Myers: Okay. And so, everyone, thank you. Dr. Wahls, thank you so much for coming on the show. That was so informative. I’m just very honored that you came on my podcast. Thank you so much.
Dr. Terry Wahls: Thank you. I’m very glad to be here.
Wendy Myers: And everyone, if you want to learn about detoxification, the modern paleo diet or healing your health conditions naturally, you can go to my site, myersdetox.com.
Definitely go check out Dr. Terry Wahls’ website. Her book is amazing. I read it cover to cover before we did the podcast. I started to read just to do the questions and I just ate it up. It’s an incredibly informative book and there’s a lot of details with the diet that I think are really good nuisances to make and something that you should definitely be adding to your plan to live to 110.
So, everyone, thank you so much for listening and thank you, Dr. Terry Wahls.
Dr. Terry Wahls: Thank you.
